It is an axiom that some things that sound so very good can sometimes be so horribly bad. So it is with the current vision of our twenty-four–hour downtown; the result of the so-called “wonderful” activity of nightclubs and revelers often comes closer to a nightmare. Someone attending an event at HP Pavilion and wanting to have a post game drink at the Tied House or a bowl of pasta at Original Joe’s, faces the equivalent of a trip from the UN Green Zone to the Baghdad airport. Few would have the temerity to attempt the short drive to either. They just go home. The same goes for anyone getting off the freeway at Santa Clara Street on a weekend. And those who live in our downtown, either in the new housing in the core or in the immediate neighborhoods, are unable to enjoy the peace and tranquility that we all need when we come home after a long day of work or play. Cruisers, youth in full-party mode, and an annoying array of troublemakers from other cities are filling up our downtown in the late-night and early-morning hours.
What’s the solution? Blame the police.
A lawsuit was filed by the Studio 8 Club this week accusing the police of everything from physically intimidating their customers to complicity in the 9/11 plot. And where is City Hall on the great issue? There is a silence. There have been few attempts at a solution; there are, however, a few more lobbyists drawing big checks and making many appointments with council members in what now passes for government in our city.
Even more inexplicable and bothersome, the Downtown Association now weighs in on the side of the ostensible offended party, i.e., the club. Scott Knies, the executive director of the group, suggested that the police are an “occupying force” and hopes this lawsuit may lead to some solutions. Huh? The police are the problem and not the rowdies, drunks, and other denizens of the dark hours? Maybe the cops should have taken it easy on the shooters of five people as they terrorized the area a while back. No need pushing citizens too far—particularly if they are armed to the teeth.
More and more, the Downtown Association is becoming an apologist for those who are creating the problems downtown and who also benefit from such a wild and inappropriate state of affairs. This sad situation is another blow to creating a “real” 24/7 downtown where citizens can work, play, sleep, and raise their children. Someone had better wake up at City Hall—and the Downtown Association—while they still have a situation that can be ameliorated and a downtown that is livable.
I bought a condo downtown and did it because I want to be in an urban environment with restaurants, bars and clubs. Those you speak of with this quote:
“……are unable to enjoy the peace and tranquility that we all need when we come home after a long day of work or play”
have a place to live in our city; its called the suburbs! For the condos to be worth buying or even the rental units, you need an urban feel.
The problems I see as a homeowner down here are related to very suspect policing. I’ve been all over the world because of my job. I’ve never seen an area that has so many police who collectively do so little.
Gang members, wanabees, and other low lifes (non of which I ever see in any restuarant bar or club) walk all over this downtown like they own it. The police never seem to do anything about them!
But go near any bar or club and your sure to find about 10 police officers scrowling at you!
I can’t get any of my 30 something friends to visit me down here. They can’t stand the cops and the thug atmosphere.
So I’m stuck taking a cab to Santana Row to enjoy a night out. Hey its only 12 bucks each way; and thousands more people and no cops.
So mister MacEnery, how many millions of dollars are not be spent downtown; because of your police force and suspect policies?
Downtown Condo Owner who spends alot elsewhere
Thank you Tom. It seems like the cruisers and thugs that hang out downtown are the elephants in the room that none of the PC crowd wants to talk about. What gives?
Tom, I think I can speak for most of the San Jose citizenry when I say that Downtown is just another District. I doubt whether many who live outside of the Downtown area really care all that much about Downtown issues.
Were the City to invest the billions of dollars spent thus far Downtown across all Districts, the City as a whole would be a much nicer place.
I’ve often wondered why there aren’t more foot patrols. Isn’t that “community policing”? Officers walking their beat, knowing the people on their beat (and knowing who doesn’t belong)?
Get off the horses. Get out of the cruisers. Get your face in the community.
Didn’t Andy Sipowicz teach us anything?
I don’t know what clubs Condo Owner goes to; but the thugs, gangbangers, and hiphoppers dominate downtown, especialmente Santa Clara Street, every Friday and Saturday night. I’d invite her/him to stand at San Pedro and Market from 11:00 p.m. to 2:00 a.m. and observe.
That said, I am not convinced that the police dept. has found the right solution to the problem as yet. It reminds me of the huge hooker problem in what is now called SoFA here in San Jose back in the late ‘70s. Traditional solutions of undercover cops posing as both hookers and Johns was totally ineffective in eradicating the problem. Chief McNamara then put out uniformed officers in droves to follow the hookers, many of whom were vanned down from Oakland by their pimps. The problem dried up quickly, since the presence of the uniformed officers discouraged the Johns, so the working girls made no money And went elsewhere to ply their trade.
In the current case, dozens of uniformed officers do not seem to have eradicated the troublemakers, while at the same time they have apparently alienated many of the law-abiding among us. Mr. Calendar cries “profiling”, despite the fact that it is clear that the ethnicities of the VAST majority of the troublemakers are well known and readily observable by all who care to do so objectively.
I wish I had the solution, but I do not. However, I am of the view that the police department and the club owners need to think outside the box and develop a strategy that best rids downtown of the troublemakers while making it attractive to the rest of us.
One tactic I read of recently is requiring music promoters, as well as the club owners, to get licenses. That way the PD can revoke the licenses of promoters who bring acts to downtown that attract the troublemakers.
When the promoters and club owners no longer make any money brining in the acts that bring in the troublemakers, the troublemakers will move elsewhere, as the hookers did. Yes, it merely moves the problem. But, frankly, we have no chance of eradicating troublemakers short of wholesale executions.
“There is a silence. There have been few attempts at a solution; there are, however, a few more lobbyists drawing big checks and making many appointments with council members in what now passes for government in our city. “
Hey Tom,
Are you going to name names?
Greg # 3 is spot-on. 90% of those who neither work nor live downtown could not care less about making San Jose a city with a vibrant 24/7 dowtown.
#6
If Tom doesn’t want to name names, you will just have to wait until October 15th for the lobbyists to file their quarterly report with the city clerk if the lobbyist is considered a lobbyist by the city.
Why not a real time system where the lobbyist fill in a quick and simple form on the city’s web site within 48 hours of a lobbying event? Resident could view all the contacts for a specific councilmember for the past days.
At least us residents might then have a bigger clue as to what is going on in our city hall.
Once again, people don’t understand where the money comes from. If it hadn’t been for downtown redevelopment that money would have never existed. It could not have been spent in even distribution among all the little fiefdoms. Redevelopment was an attempt to invest in the city, creating revenue for the general fund to benefit the entire city. It was not a willy-nilly spending plan designed to throw money into a black hole.
Besides, as Mayor Gonzo proved, if you don’t like Downtown redevelopemtn, go out and create a redevelopment district of your own!
regarding the ansere to your question. The only way any of us have been able to talk to the mayor or council is by hiring a lobbyist firm. Without doing that we can’t get a meeting.
John Micheal, the police won’t let the club / bar owners take part in any solutions. Its thier way or the highway.
Thier way isn’t working!
Must agree with bar owner on both counts.
The council is completely out of touch with constituents, and all its members seem to hold themselves collectively aloof from the people they allegedly represent…unless those people pay to play.
Are they really all just Terry Gregorys with a bit more spohistication?
#11 JMO, the answer is YES. We have a huge residential development that was approved in D9 for Samaritan Drive where a beautifully wooded office complex currently stands. The neighborhood went to the council concerned about traffic issues (Samaritan Drive will certainly be overloaded when this project completes) and numerous other negative impacts and requested that the Council not approve the development, but it was clearly a done deal before any public commenting was allowed. So much for Judy Chirco caring about anything but lining developers’ pockets, just like her 10 colleagues.
It comes as no surprise that people like bar owner are ignored by these 11 spineless marionettes.
Mark T #12: By the time the neighbors went to the council, the deal had long been done.
Ever since I have followed the council—1973—the public comment hearing has been a complete sham…yes, even during Tom McE’s time.The decision had been made at least by the Committee of the Whole a few days before, if not weeks in advance.
It’s a lot light oral argument in court. The decision is virtaully made after a reading of the briefs. Oral argument is a courtesy, at best, in most instances.
I have long believed that the meeting at which the public is allowed to comment should precede the meeting in which the final vote is cast by at least two weeks. That would at least give the appearance that the will of the people was considered.
the problem is SJPD has a bunch of greenhorn cops in blue jumpsuits that think they are god like beings for example just monday at 10 am meridian and blackford 1sjpd blue and white with 2 officers pull over a blue van with 1 vietamese occupant 1 minute later another sjpd car pulls up and is unable to park so he turns on his red and blue lights and double parks blocking traffic in one lane ,1 minute later another sjpd pulls up in the median and sits in his car and shouts back and forth for ten minutes with his buddy on the curb as the other two search the van while the vietnamese man is made to sit in the dirt and they shout at him pointing there fingers at him and all of a sudden they get some real police work to do and 2 cars take off speeding away southbound and the third northbound and the vietnamese man is still sitting in the dirt finally gets up shaken and drives away
#6
Good idea about real time reporting. You should contact Ed Rast and the Sunshine Taskforce.
14 – On the surface, your eye-witness account helps your argument. The problem with police matters though is you don’t know all the details. You can only surmise from what you see but you can’t fill in the blanks. We don’t know why the van was stopped or what they were looking for. Did the additional officers just show up or were they called for addtional back-up? It is easy for all of us to criticize based on part of the story. The problem is, due to the nature of police work, not all of the information can be made available to the public (at least not immediately.) I don’t have a magic solution. I’m just saying we should temper our criticism a bit when we don’t have all of the facts.
Can I be in the middle on this issue? Condo owner is correct in many of his comments. I also don’t want to be unsafe downtown.
For the sake of arguement we need to define what a “thug crowd” is.
First, there are the people who on the streets for drugs, gangs and other unknown reasons.
Second, there are the party-goers who dress urban, drink and have fun. They didn’t go to Bellarmine (with exception) so they are generalized as “thug” because well…they don’t look like you and me on a night out. BUT…they make San Jose nightlife what it is and are good people.
I am hoping some of you are not putting these two categories together when talking about how “bad” our nightlife is. Otherwise, argue on.
Since Tom McE. and no one else won’t mention the fact that Cindy Chavez – City Councilmember, Vice Mayor, and current VTA Board Chair – represents the Downtown area, I will…
Recall a Metro story back in 2003 where Chavez formed a “task force” of downtown residents, biz owners, and police on how downtown can be made more attractive yet more secure…
http://www.metroactive.com/papers/metro/05.30.02/public-eye-0222.html
(under Police Trait)
What happened as a result of the task force? Evidently, from followup posts, nothing. Tom et al. need to note well that all of this is ultimately occuring on the watch of Chavez, and remember it during the mayoral debates coming soon.
Local #17:I can’t speak for others, but I can mostly differentiate the thugs from the “urban dressers” as you call them. Some of those “urban dressers” however, are thug wannabes. I can differentiate those by the way they interact with me. Others may not be able to do so.
But for many, if you walk like a duck and quack like a duck….well, you get it. So, if you don’t want to be categorized as a thug, don’t TRY to look or act like a thug. I don’t get this “I wanna look like an thug, dress like a thug, act like a thug, and be like a thug, but I want to be treated like the suburban punk-as*-b*tch that I am” attitude. Maybe someone can help me understand that.
Eugene#18: Ms. Chavez was quoted in the link you provided as having said:“As San Jose becomes a 24-hour, seven-day city, [ain’t happened yet] everything we do in the downtown has to evolve with that. What I really want is that we have entertainment and policing strategies that encourage people to come downtown and enjoy themselves in a safe environment.”
I cannot diagree with her stated goal. I don’t see that it has happened yet. I also see no follow through on any studies. That’s the problem with process/studies/surveys—no implementation. We need far fewer studies, more action and resolution of the problem.
If San Jose and Thug Clubs are so desperate for downtown customers – why not set up a 4-6 block ” Thug Club district ” with Thug Clubs permits that pay for extra Police in that area
Downtown will never attract large numbers of regular downtown customers if the thugs, thug wannabees or their hangers on JMOC’s suburban punk-as*-b*tch that I am” losers control the steeets after dark with hundreds of riot ready Police stand around Too many other places to go to spend their dollars
San Jose’s clueless City Council, Chamber and downtown business owners continue to drive away businesses, customers, jobs and is incapable of understanding what it takes have economic success downtown or in San Jose
Thug Club #21—so where will it be—King & Story, The Great Mall? No, of course not! It should be at the Santa Clara County Fairgrounds, and The County can manage it. After all, the Supes wanted a venue, and the fairgrounds already attracts most of the parolees in the area.
Evolution.
That’s the biggest problem with the perception of Downtown. It’s something that’s evolving. Evolution is not a “do/done” thing. With an evolutionary process you can’t say “hasn’t happened yet”.
The problem with the entire redevelopment process is that people are looking for a “do/done” timeline. Are we there yet are we there yet are we there yet are we there yet?
No, we’re not there yet. It’s still evolving. It’s a project of such massive scope that it will take a long time to get there.
But you don’t give up on going somewhere just because you’re not there yet. That’s what I’m hearing from many in this discussion. The old tired arguments “haven’t we spent enough?”, “when will it be finished?”, “why do we need to spend all that money on one district?” are getting old, like the child in the back seat yelling “are we there yet are we there yet are we there yet are we there yet are we there yet?”
Dan matthews ,i do know the details i have a scanner and heard both ends of the call ,so much for on the surface
I find myself compeled to shovel some manure out of the horse stable.
So, grab that shovel and we’ll do it together, OK?
How many of you lived and or rented in Sal Si Puedes? That is besides Cesar Chavez?
How many of you know that Sal Si Puedes is a stones throw from the Mexican Heritage Gardens?
How many of you know that most of the children that live there have elevated BLOOD LEAD levels.
How many of you know that many of those that rent and live there are 2,3, and 4 families per house?
How many of you know that the area in and around San Antonio Grammer School is contamiated with lead?
How many of you know that this condition has existed for a quarter century?
How many of you know that it took a dedicated iliterate mexican woman and her three children to change the politics of the Heller St. slums?
How many of you know that once black listed for wanting a better life for her children she was evicted, and had to sleep in her car with her children for 6 months, while still sending her children to school?
How many of you know who the district representive was ?
How many of you can guess who that guy was?
How many of you think he will make a difference in the 3rd district?
How many of you live in the 3rd district?
How many of you like what is occuring there?
How many of you really care?
How many of you belive that the guys that rode the tail coats of the last mayor want change?
How many of you feel deep down that you are being set up once again?
How many of you have had it up to here?
How many of you realize that for 8 years district 3 has become a hell hole after dark?
How many of you are simply going to rag and go along?
How many of you are standing on the line, waiting for that next opportunity to shake the hell out of that trees, where all the snakes hide?
Good job! Stable’s clean. Let’s make some horse shoes maybe some leg irons as well!
The Village Black Smith
24 – So what were the details??
26 – I’ve always had the impression that San Jose taxpayers have had the “isn’t it done yet” impression of Downtown. The truch that no one tells is that redevelopment is a process that takes longer than one mayoral administration to fully take root and come to fruition. Unfortunately, San Jose has not had a political machine powerful enough to keep the momentum of the original vision going. The vision changed under Hammer and was completley extinguished under Gonzales.
I’ve always been a believer in Downtown. I’d like nothing more than to see the full potential of redevelopment realized. But I also realize that for all intents and purposes the real effort at redeveloping Downtown ended 10 years ago, and will never have the momentum and drive it had under TMcE. The city lacks the collective will to see it through. No one cares enough.
And now all that money and effort is truly wasted.
So Chuck Rufus Reed sold his vote to his client.
Not there first time either
Greg,
How does a redevelopment agency divert dollars away from schools?
In San Jose RDA money have been used to improve schools.
One solution for keeping the peace downtown is having an independent DA. The fact that Carr’s husband is a Lt. on SPJD can only make this issue worse.
We have a 24hr. downtown because of all the diversity of intertainments in the area plus all those housing are in place downtown. It comes with a price- lots of clubs seeking patrons. Therefore, you get all kinds of people and some you may not like. Tom is right that we have too many clubs in the area, but I’m quick to point out that we have a comedy club, Camera 12 cinemas and a variety of entertainment options to chose from. Hey, we also have a concert hall for midsized rock shown at the Civic. I’d rather it be rock’n rolling all night than having a dead downtown we used to have before year 2000, but it comes with a price!
In every city, there is a downtown and there is a place where the locals go.
On another subject, has anyone heard if there are any takers to the city’s offer to lower landing fees to attract more coast to coast and international flights to SJC?
Check out this news story about our local Mayoral race:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dRTz7ukONM
You should also watch this news story from KGO:
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=local&id=4559458
The fact of the matter is Downtown is a loss. Most of us who love San Jose at one time or another have tried to go downtown and enjoy the night life. But the people that are down there are mostly slobs, the only people that go down there are out of towners who have no idea what their getting into. 1 visit and the rest of the time they stay in their hotel room. I’m sure other cities have the same problems but traveling around the US San Jose really ranks way down the ladder for a fun place to visit. People have tried for a long time to change it but nothing seems to work. So most of us that want a good time somewhere head to Sunnyvale, Mt. View, Los Gatos, etc. It’s a shame because there is so much potential.
#29-
The redevelopment agency gets its revenue from “property tax increment”, or the increases in property tax assessments.
Normally, the increase in property tax would go to all the agencies which collect property tax, such as schools.
When there is a redevelopment agency, that increase in property tax collected goes to the RDA, instead of the schools.
This hurts not just the schools, but also the county, city, water district, and anyone who collects property tax.
I’m not up for debating BART right now. There isn’t enough money for it, so it’s moot.
Another coherent statement from a Shills for Chavez.
RIP-
You don’t give up just because you’re not there yet.
But you do give up when it is clear that you are not making progress, or when it is clear that the progress is not worth the cost.
Redevelopment agencies divert millions of dollars away from other government agencies, most notably schools.
That’s a very high cost. I don’t think we can point to enough progress to justify it.
DETAILS the van was driving to slow ,creating a traffic hazard ,but in turn sjpd created a far more dangerous traffic hazard ,1 by blocking the slow lane and ,2 by blocking the median for 10 plus minutes just to chat ,it just seems to me that the younger cops are very rude and very uninformed ,you would not believe how many times they have to ask directions on how or where a certain street is ,is there no maps available to look at in there off hours?
#38
Interesting observation…
This might explain why San Jose schools, and in particular the schools in Cindy’s district are the least funded and lowest performing in the county. If I’m reading Larry Stone’s report correctly, San Jose RDA diverted 14.7% of the property tax revenue to pay for a 24×7 downtown and land for a baseball team that will never come. Whereas, Palo Alto diverted NO taxes away from its schools and Cupertino RDA only diverted 1%.
In Cindy’s Horace Mann “Success Story” about the elementary school with most stellar API scores, she helped create an “innovative” partnership between the RDA and San Jose Unified School District. Let’s see… was the innovation that RDA diverted money only to give it back to a school that would have received it in the first place? I’m confused, I thought that in this SNI fairytale, Robin’ Hood is suppose to steal from the rich to give to the poor? Not steal from the schools in the lowest income neighborhoods? And why is Chuck Reed admiring the SNI program?
Hey meatheads, go to downtown Chicago core and there’s no nightlife once-so ever! You don’t realize you have it this good here. What’s the matter with you? There is no entertainment in Chicago’s real downtown. Remember, it can be worst, much worst. So come and enjoy San Jose’s downtown!
41 – Remember, satire day is usually Friday, not Saturday. Thanks for the chuckle, though.
I have a real problem with the way the SJPD Police downtown. As a business owner downtown I don’t go out clubbing very much but I do drive thru downtown at night and go to the movies. The police are presence is way too much at night and would be much better if they were walking beats.
NOW, where are they during the daytime? The most successful business men downtown are the DRUG DEALERS, we need the police donwtown walking the streets to get rid of these guys, this is the real problem for me. They don’t need to be chasing away club goers at night.
#43- Downtown Guy:
Amen!
Apparently there is not enough budget for the police to come downtown during the day; despite documentation and complaints from multiple business owners. How this is the case is beyond me, considering the ridiculous and over the top amount of PD that’s out on Friday and Saturday nights. You reap what you sow. Downtown’s club scene was not as dangerous as the chicken littles of the world like to make it seem. Funny, though, now that we have so much police presence, the clientele has declined just as the caliber of downtown club goer.
It’ll get worse before it gets better downtown unless new budget priorities are established. We are getting higher and higher downtown residential density, but no extra cops on the force.
I’m already rethinking my plan to move out of Willow Glen and into downtown.