Knowing San Jose as well as I do, I sometimes forget how people who move here view this town. My friend just moved back to San Jose after living in Hawaii for eight years, started working at a restaurant downtown, and really is starting to get to know the area well. So it was interesting when she started commenting on and questioning the status of downtown San Jose.
My friend has lived in Honolulu, Santa Barbara and San Diego. She says that she has never seen a downtown transform so much from the work week to the weekend and that it’s amazing how walking around downtown during the lunch rush you see one San Jose, and then at night, a far different scene—one she termed “a little ghetto.” (To make it clear, use of the word “ghetto” has nothing to do with race or ethnicity, rather the behavior of many downtown dwellers.) As simplified as that description may sound, it’s a refrain we’ve heard for some time from many others. We talked about the cruising, the heavy police enforcement, and how an older couple from Los Gatos, for example, might choose Santana Row for a night out other than San Jose because it just seems safer and less hectic. We both agreed that often downtown’s bark is worse than its bite, but people are turned off by the cruising cars with music blaring and cops patrolling the streets. However, appearances mean a lot and that opinion is not going to change until we see those things eliminated from our downtown.
She also said the one thing downtown needs is retail. We talked about how Santana Row should be a lesson to everyone in other parts of the city, mainly downtown in this case, who shouldn’t suffer as a result of another part of town getting resources, development and the attention of City Hall. For too long, downtown has been the red-headed stepchild of the city. The people in City Hall need to make hard decisions about eliminating the current problems downtown, making things happen more quickly, including the push for retail, and starting to put downtown first because it needs their help.
Why anyone living there would move away from Santa Barbara is beyond me. The fact that your friend did this throws her judgement into question.
Please don’t anyone hold your breath for major retail downtown. Not until there are more people living downtown will any sort of large scale retail development work. Downtown Los Angeles is a little ahead of San Jose in implementing this formula, and it appears to be working there. No reason it won’t work here either, but it will take time.
SG, there’s little new in this discussion that has not been discussed to death on this board. The thug behavior, the overzealous police presence, it’s old news. I hope the “soft closings” help the situation but things won’t change until some of the thug clubs close the the cops ease up.
In the area around downtown, 97% of the population is nonwhite. If DOA has the right to choose to hang out at Santana Row, nonwhite people have every right to hang out in downtown too, and each will behave as each thinks is proper. So what if they’re doing things that don’t conform to “non-ghetto” standards? It’s their city too.
Retail: I think DSJ has an opportunity to capitalize on the Tower 88/CIM project and Living Tomorrow/MESA proposal (possible Starwood hotel?) to make San Fernando St. between 1st and 4th a retail destination. I’ve read on-line rumors that Virgin Megastore and Borders might set up camp in the CIM project (we shall see). Again, make the sidewalk of San Fernando wider to allow for more outdoor dining, as well as to encourage better landscaping; Pedestrian Friendly!
Cruising: Make Santa Clara Street Un-cruisable (is that a word?)! Again, wider sidewalks to make SC more pedestrian friendly, wide-landscaped median, and one-way traffic between Alamden and 4th. As someone who onced cruised El Camino as a teen, I can tell you that wide streets with 2-3 lanes of traffic in one direction (as well as no median to “eye” other cruisers) are highly sought after.
Clubs: More bars and lounges catering to the 30+ crowd and less clubs for youngsters. Nothing attracts thugery and cruisers more than scantly dressed twentysomething year olds looking for Vegas-style nightlife.
It’s time for DSJ to grow up and cease trying to be “Sin City.” Only then will Santana Row become everyones second favority destination.
Another impediment to big box retail downtown is the parking situation.
San Franciscans are accustomed to paying for parking when they shop around Union Square. San Joseans are not so accustomed, and would rather go to Valley Fair, Oakridge, or Santana Row where parking is free.
More restaurants keep opening in SR, and they all seem to be full, except perhaps Tanglewood, which has too limited a menu and gouging prices for what they deliver. SR is delivering the restaurant product many people appear to enjoy.
I suspect more of the expensive specialty shops in SR will be replaced with more restaurants. SJ doesn’t have the demographic for such a spate of luxury retail.
I am anxiously awaiting more of the medium rise residences to be completed to see if there is one I would buy. 360 residences has several shortfalls in design, such as no availability for ceiling lighting, since they are not building electrical to allow for it as a personal upgrade; really cheap cabinetry; very limited parking for residents and none for guests; stuck with wall to wall carpet, whether you like it or not, with no hardwood floor option available. Perhaps they’ll see the light and make appropriate changes in construction and options.
City Heights is a low end product in most respects, but it should fill up quickly.
Still no idea what the retail will be in CIM’s project. But we’ll need a lot more density than is currently in the pipeline to make downtown retail work…and there’s still the parking issue.
Single Gal, when are you ever going to learn that you’re still ignorant with your short-sighted out of town guest. Downtown is wonderful the way it is. It already has some retail(“On First”, Chic Chateau and others) in downtown. Take a stroll again. What about the lunch rush during weekdays and families strolling around on weekends. At night, the downtown is buzzing with assortments of clubs, live music, theater and comedy. You just never learn and constantly regret that I was right the whole time like many times before. Ok, we do have cruising because we all like to be downtown.
To achieve the goal of a vibrant Downtown and of an enchanting Alviso waterfront, then elect Nora Campos for Mayor in 2010.
Yeah SG, first impressions of SJ over the years from my circle of friends…
“Damn your airport sucks”
“There sure are alot of Indian Resturants”
“The freeways are filled with trash”
“Which way is Monterey/Los Gatos/Palo Alto/ San Francisco”
What San Jose needs to do is look at Portland, OR. Talk about a city with an *authentic* downtown that is also commercially viable. Downtown Portland has a mall (as well as a free-standing Macy’s and Nordstrom’s), and it competes with a large suburban mall (Lloyd center) right across the river. This shows that Downtown SJ retail is not necessarily precluded by the proximity of SR and VF, given the right private and public investments.
Of course, the citizens of Portland seem much more invested in their city, and especially their downtown, than the citizens of this city.
So we have a downtown that transforms from one extreme to the other….and being dynamic is bad? We have multiple areas in SR and DT that offer a wide array of options…and this diversity is bad?
Let’s rethink our viewpoint before we hastily turn San Jose into 175 square miles of sameness.
JMO, I don’t think the lack of free parking would be an issue IF the right type of retail operations were to locate downtown. The right type being those that can’t be found at any of the malls that do have free parking, as well as those that would be enough of a draw to attract people to downtown as a shopping destination in spite of the parking issue. Bloomingdales comes to mind but there are smaller operations that can also attract shoppers.
The way I see it, there is so much disposable income in this valley that most people who are willing to pay more for a few ounces of Schmarbuck’s than for a gallon of premium gasoline would also have no problem paying to park. And I would assume there would be a validation option anyway.
This is all such a long way off. We’ve beaten the dead horse to death on this issue here on SJI.
Too bad about 360. Clearly a case of a misguided developer who is more about turning as huge a profit as possible instead of building a quality product. It would seem the term “luxury” does not apply to this address and that’s just so typical of the type of thing the SJ councils have approved for the downtown over the years. Some things appear doomed never to change when it comes to leadership in this town.
We talk about these issues over and over b/c they haven’t been solved, and I think its always great to come up with new solutions….
We are all outsiders in our own down town.
Poet Roberto Tinoco Duran made it simple.
“Left wing, Right wing.
“Politics”!
“It doesn’t Fly!”
Cruisers cruise because they can.
Politicions cruise because they can.
Cops cruise because they can.
I choose Santana Row because I can.
D.O.A.
You have an airport downtown. What else do you want?
Go there, eat and drink, and watch the planes take-off and land. What fun. What adventure.
No wonder downtown attracts such a great crowd.
Same discussion, different day and most of you still after months have no clue or understanding of many reasons why downtown San Jose can not attract retail stores but Santana Row can
Retailers locate stores where there are either existing customers with money to spend or where customers are willing to travel, which is not downtown San Jose but is Santana Row
People go to downtowns where they feel safe, where people like them shop, where there are unique stores and restaurants that are not available in local malls, which is not downtown San Jose but is Santana Row and other downtowns
People are willing to pay for parking in city downtowns where they want to go, if unique stores are not available nearby with free parking like Santana Row which is not downtown San Jose
Business locate in cities that make it easy to be successful, have low fees and short approval times and do not put unreasonable requirements or costs on them compared to other nearby locations like Santana Row, which is not downtown San Jose
Most of you and Council have absolutely no understanding of how or why retailers or businesses make location decisions from dozens of possible locations but are willing to drive miles to shop in Santana Row, but not downtown San Jose
Santana Row would have never been located in downtown San Jose then or now, but Santana Row is generating taxes and jobs for San Jose rather than Santa Clara or Cupertino
San Jose does not have enough city money to attract desirable retailers to downtown San Jose, without desirable retail success conditions like Santana Row, which is not downtown San Jose
You wrote “how an older couple from Los Gatos, for example, might choose Santana Row for a night out other than San Jose”.
Last time I checked Santana Row is in San Jose.
#16. Santana Row has “unique stores”? Virtually everything there is a national chain, except for a few restaurants. At least there are still some businesses downtown whose owners actually live here.
Girlfromthenet –
Thank you for catching me on my oh so crucial error, but I think you are missing the point.
Here’s what they should do with downtown San Jose:
Spend 25 years and gazillions of dollars on redevelopment.
Move City Hall downtown.
Have big events like an auto race, or a jazz festival. Some kind of Christmas thing might be good. Make it a tradition.
Be sure to locate downtown smack dab next to a big University.
Have night clubs, museums, a big swanky hotel and a convention center. Add a mix of pricey restaurants and affordable eateries. Toss in a park with some controversial artwork and a corporate headquarters with spinning semaphore coded messages just to get conversations started.
Don’t forget the sports arena that doubles as a huge entertainment venue that brings in everyone from Pavarotti to the Rolling Stones. A hockey team would be nice.
Then stand back and listen as people complain because there’s no retail, or unicorns.
Today’s Mercury has article about San Jose possibly losing it’s Safest Large City title because property crimes have increased because ocus is on gangs and youth problems – read downtown
San Jose Police are doing a great job with very few officers but we need more officers or crimes will get worst
Very few 30-50’s customers and businesses will go to downtown after dark unless we change public perception of downtown’s after dark combat zone appearance
Why not establish very high fines and require 4-10 weekends of public service for all after dark downtown violations in downtown club area for fighting, alcohol, drugs, traffic, public drunkenness, public urination and property damage
Speaking of downtown and perceptions of not being safe. I’ve spoken to a few SJPD officers who work downtown on a constant basis “for the overtime.” It appears that downtown San Jose is a cash cow for officer overtime. If downtown San Jose became more like Los Gatos or Santan Row, the cash cow that is overtime would cease to exist. Our men and women wearing blue do an excellent job of keeping San Jose safe, but perhaps from a capitalism and standard of living standpoint, they like downtown just the way it is.
#16,
I have to disagree with you on one thing. DSJ does have unique, quality restaurants comparable to Santana Row…Give me E&O Trading Co. any day over Straits, Original Joes over Maggiano’s, Gordon Biersch over any of those fake European Bistros.
Also, while we can agree that Santana Row has hurt DSJ in the short term, it doesn’t mean it’s doomed eternally. As others have stated on this site, one just has to look south to LA to see a downtown that has recently rebounded: Staples Center, LA Live development, Condos, lofts, Ralphs supermarket (just to name a few highlights). Downtown LA’s resurgence has taken place even with high-end retail centers such as Melrose Avenue and Rodeo Drive in the vicinity (not even counting the bazillion malls that dot the southland). Yes, LA is a lot larger than SJ, but it’s not as if we are on par with Los Banos population wise. Santa Clara Valley/San Jose has the population and wealth to support multiple retail areas. DSJ could be one of them, but as #10 stated beautifully, citizens of this valley have to be more invested in the core of the nations 10th largest city.
Your friend is right—it is ghetto. I’m only 28, and I will chose Santana Row over downtown any night of the week.