Your City At Work (Sort Of)
QUESTION: How many San Jose city employees does it take to remove illegal signs? ANSWER: Zero—they don’t do this sort of thing.
On a recent weekend, I observed someone on a ladder hammering a sign into a telephone post. I wasn’t able to get his license plate, but I did take down the phone number that appeared on the many signs that he had placed on the posts. (The signs were professionally done, and advertised a window tinting business).
The next Monday, I placed a call to the city’s Code Enforcement Department to file a report. The first person referred me to a second person, who referred me to a third person’s voice mail. When I finally got to speak to the “right” person, I was informed that Code Enforcement only dealt with private property, and that I needed to talk to the City’s Department of Transportation (DOT). Great!
I then called the DOT where I had an illuminating exchange. I was told that the DOT “did not have ladders” (to remove the signs). I suggested that someone from Code Enforcement or the DOT could simply call the number that appeared on the signs and tell the business that it is illegal to post signs on public property, inform them of the amount of the fines, and instruct them that they have one week to remove all of the signs that they had hung up, or they would be cited. I was told that they couldn’t do that! However, my brief conversation with the DOT worker did not lack imagination. The worker wondered if perhaps PG&E might be able to help as the signs were placed on telephone poles!
Our discussion concluded with a polite request that I fax over the necessary information (i.e. the location of the signs, etc). I was told that they would get to it eventually (perhaps in a month) that there are only two “complaint trucks” working to cover the entire city, and that they are, of course, very busy removing garbage from streets and empty lots.
Why are things so complicated? The problem might have been solved in five minutes if someone from Code Enforcement had simply placed a call to the offending party and instructed them to remove the signs or face a citation.
UPDATE: The signs are still up. I haven’t gotten around to faxing the DOT yet. I apologize to the citizens of San Jose for not getting the job done!
Thanks for protecting our big gated community.
Pete,
Thank you for writing on this topic. Sadly, your experience could be applied to far more City departments than just those two. When ever I’ve tried to report illegal sales of animals outdoors, I’m either called a liar in a very PC way, or I’m told someone will look into it, and I never hear back unless I press the issue, which of course I do. If I complain to my D9 Council Office about no response I usually get the,” How long ago did you call or send an email? Two weeks ago? Well, I’d give it a little more time, they’re pretty busy.”
Or if I’m reporting speeding or parking violations by the parents of the school next door, I get the same BS run around you got. Since when am I being paid to do so many City departments jobs?
That’s what public employees do, Pete—think of as many ways as possible to say “no” and to not work. And for this they are paid handsomely, and have benefits the rest of us can only dream of having. I’d suggest calling the office of the councilmember whose distrtic the signs are in.
What we need is more sign police. Actually, why don’t ya round up a posse and hang the no good so and so?
I saw a guy spit on the ground the other day, I keep kickin’ myself for not making a citizens arrest. When will the city rid themselves of the expectorants?
I saw lady crossing in the middle of the street—she got away as I lawfully walked to the corner to cross the street. The harlot.
One of my neighbors left their garbage can out an extra day. I got him with a dirty note. I doubt if he’ll ever think twice about letting that happen again.
Or maybe Pete, you just have too much time on your hands. Just a thought.
It takes a village to provide the services that the village’s tax dollar funded bureaucracy is supposed to provide.
As for me, I’m doing my part and am signing up for Roadwork and Pothole Maintenance 101 at SJ City College next week.
The way I see it, if enough of us villagers take the initiative we can fix our own potholes and repave our own streets and make our village a better village.
Rich,
Have you upped the dosage of your curmudgeon pills? Can you imagine if signs were never removed – the poles would crumble with the weight of all that crap! And lately, the offenders are using heavy plastic fastened with screws… they’re not going to deteroriate anytime soon.
JMO, you’re right on about calling one’s councilperson. I did just that a couple of months ago and the aide mustered the proper people to remove the signs. The signs were particularly offensive, as they solicited folks facing foreclosure to sell for cash to them – a big scam, I’m certain.
Greg,
I’m not spending my time taking down license plate numbers of those who put up signs.
So who is the curmudgeon?
We have too many laws, too few people to enforce the real ones that actually need enforcement and too many people wanting more laws for every conceivable potential ill they conjure up in their own mind.
What about a little freedom, including the right to free speech? This guy paid for a professional sign, you may not like his message or his service—but does that warrant a citation and a fine?
Supporting our tax dollars going to a bureaucrat to take down signs, while the Fed, State and Local goverments face BK.
If a sign so offends Mr. Campbell, get thee a ladder and remove it yourself.
Better yet let the people who own the poles decide when to remove it. It’s their property.
Rich,
I looked carefully at my post and can find no evidence that I claimed I logged license numbers. Those foreclosure signs can be particularly dangerous to older residents, as well as those less financially astute. I don’t know about you, but it concerns me when someone loses everything to a scam artist… perhaps you simply don’t care.
On another subject, paying for a professional sign and posting it anywhere one chooses is not constitutionally protected free speech. Without some sort of enforcement, you might wake up some morning to find your house plastered with all manner of advertisements. Can you grasp that concept or is it too complicated?
Ferchrissake, Rich Robinson and Nam Turk. Are you both so deaf, blind, and ignorant that you can’t understand that Mr. Campbell’s point was that OUR city, which takes OUR tax dollars to enforce the laws that THEY create, is so incredibly LAZY and INCOMPETENT and SELF-SERVING that they can’t even be engaged in a discussion about the rules that they, themselves have imposed on US.
Where do you think your tax dollars go? Do you care? Or don’t you pay property tax? Or are you so well off that it doesn’t matter to you?
Wake up. We have a City Government that is concerned only about themselves.
Their vacation days.
Their sick days.
Their wrongful termination lawsuits.
Their benefits.
What’s the point in paying for a Government that isn’t interested in the responsibilities that Government exists for in the first place?
Hey Rich:
What are you talking about? It’s against the law to hang private signs on public or private property. This isn’t about speech…it’s about clutter.
If it’s okay to hammer private advertising on to telephone poles and streetlamps, I plan to take full advantage of it! So will several hundred others.
Pete Campbell
The McDonnalds at MidTown has 17 signs up. Looks trashy. Where are the code people?
It is not about free speech?
The Constitution allows governments to regulate the time, manner and place of speech—but not the content.
But governments have used this interpretation to severely limit and curtail the content of speech.
To show how far this has gone, you can protest the decisions of George W. Bush—but only if you pay to get a permit and are far enough away from the majority population not be heard.
Thirty years ago we had no sign ordinances, to my knowledge—if we did they were never enforced.
Common sense was used in place of rigid rules on clutter—then somebody got offended by a sign—and government imposed a set of rules. Most of which are probably unconstitutional because they are not reasonable—but who will challenge them?
We ban signs of public property. Who owns that property? The public—not the governments. Anyone should be allowed to post their free speech in a reasonable manner. But governments are more and more illegally restricting property rights of the public by claiming they “own” the property.
To show you how absurd this has become—a candidate for City Council in Campbell was admonished by the local City Attorney for using the Seal of the City and a picture of the library in their brochure.
This became a news article. And given it was a City Attorney’s opinion it appeared as if the candidate had in someway unethically violated some City rules.
But the City Attorney had no right to limit the use of the seal or the library in a political contest. NONE, ZERO, ZILCH.
The City does not own the seal—the public does and they have a right to use it for political speech. (Commercial Speech is another issue.)
But the political damage was done, the candidate was not elected. Governments continue to think of themselves as private entities—and it just ain’t so.
But nobody is going to spend thousands of dollars to challenge the constitutionality of these laws or interpretations—because it is economically not viable.
Thus freedom, like the ice in the Artic Circle, is being quickly eroded to the point that someday it will no longer exist.
Laws like this are not enforced until there is a complaint. It’s like noise ordinances—your party isn’t a nuisance until someone is annoyed.
Pete made a call, and he’s right—there’s a law, there’s a complaint, and now we’re missing a response. I don’t think Pete is even asking for a timely or effective response—just a pulse, indicating that city services still have a heartbeat.
I pay property taxes, and so now I agree with him. How are they being spent again?
Can we get rid of the expressway system, too? Those things are way uglier than a billion signs.
Rich,
What’s your address? I have some very large signs I’d like to post on the public acoutrements surrounding your house.
Greg,
Feel free, but note that Code Enforcement in Cupertino is highly effective and they will remove the signs in 24 hours and cite you.
Some cities have employees with nothing better to do or they are highly motivated, hardworking civil servants—your choice.
Rich is right!
If we started enforcing sign laws they’d have to round up all the politicians (and their campaign consultants) who allow campaign signs to clutter up on every pole in town.
Hmm…come to think of it…
Pete,
In fairness to the street level city workers perhaps they legitimately do not have the manpower to take down the thousands of these signs around the city. Our police department is hundreds of officers short working at 1994 levels so it is not that far fetched to assume other street level workers have also been cut back severely? Maybe some of the bloated administration should get their butts out cleaning up signs but don’t blame the 2 trucks trying to take care of a million residents requests. It is too bad you fan the flames of hating city workers as is obvious with the replies to this topic.
Pete, maybe you need to take more responsibility in fixing this problem. Go get out a ladder and take down the sign yourself. Have the balls to call the company yourself first and don’t expect government to take care of every little problem. To quote you, “Why are things so complicated? The problem might have been solved in five minutes if someone from Code Enforcement had simply placed a call to the offending party and instructed them to remove the signs or face a citation.” You have made things complicated by not trying to solve the problem first. If I have a problem at Safeway I talk to the manager, I don’t call the city to fix the problem. Did you try calling the business yourself? You are rather hypocritical because in your prior posts you blast ‘big’ government, but now that it is your problem you want ‘big’ government to fix the problem.
To O’Connor #3,
As usual you also blast city workers when you have the opportunity. “That’s what public employees do, Pete—think of as many ways as possible to say “no” and to not work. And for this they are paid handsomely, and have benefits the rest of us can only dream of having.” Having read SJI for quite awhile most of the readers know you are a lawyer. Lawyers are some of the sleaziest, laziest, self serving, and dishonest people in our society, with a few exceptions. Talk about a profession that rips off those they are suppose to be ‘serving’. Lawyers are in large part the reason our country is on the verge of a major recession (see politicians and ‘environmental’ lawyers). Please clean up your own profession.
Also, I am retired from a grocery store, not a city.
#19 Rich: You left out another important benefit to campaign signs…they give the candidates something to yell about every time a kid steals a sign off someone’s lawn.
Silly as it sounds in some communities sign-snatching becomes a hot political issue.
MC,
Nice catch! I do make a handsome commission off campaign signs.
However, as I tell my clients—no one I know ever voted for a sign.
Two, while signs are easy money for Consultants, I insist they pony up for the direct mail costs first.
And three, while candidates and their supporters like signs—to me they are a huge waste of campaign resources.
So why do I buy them for my clients? Because if you don’t—the candidate and their supporters go nuts.
P.S. People pay big bucks for that kind of wisdom.
P.S.S. I won dinner from a friend when I correctly predicted Paul Fong would win the Democratic primary based on the fact Dominic Casserta had the better sign campaign.
It is much easier to accuse your opponent of sign stealing than to come up with a popular way to balance a budget.
Issues of distraction. . .a hallmark of our “best system in the world”.
Steve # 18, you’re right—the 95% of the lawyers who are sleazy ruin it for the rest of us.
But we do earn our $$ championing the causes of all manner of idiots and malefactors. If people didn’t make mistakes, we’d all be out of work.
Go clip some coupons, Steve.
JMO 22,
I admire you for saying so. You should run for president of the BAR association.